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Topic: The Son of Thunder

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The Son of Thunder

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David Hill 29 Dec 2003 The Son of Thunder

I am the Resurrection and the Life. He that believes and me and dies, yet shall live and he that believes in me and lives shall never die...

Several years ago now, I sent in a post on the Son of Thunder, but unfortunately I forgot to save the draft and it is no longer in the achieves. I had been contemplating retyping it up, so, I figured that this must be the leading of the Spirit, so here it is.

I stumbled on to this theory when I realized that man's first six thousand years would be divided up into three groups of 2000 yrs each and that this symbolized the Trinity. And, in the first 2000 God the Father was typified by Enoch who did not die and thus lived forever like the Ancient of Days Himself. It was easy, therefore, to make the connection of the second set to God the Son who was represented by Elijah who was also taken up to heaven without dying and thus represents Y'shua who also is God. Thus, in theory, there should be a third individual that represents the third set of 2000 years which itself typifies the Holy Spirit.

The only conclusion would be John who, it is possible, might not have died, but, like the Holy Spirit that has gone out into all the earth, John has been walking the earth for all these years.

When you look at the Scriptures and Church History, it provides circumstantial evidence that, though it does not prove the theory, it certainly does not disprove it either.

His name, John Zebedee would mean, literally, A Gift from the Eternal Giver that Endures and exactly what gift could the Eternal One give someone that would last forever? Obviously it would be Eternal Life. Thus it is that John mentions Eternal Life more than all the other writers of the New Testament combined. John was extremely interested in this Gift.

Now, place yourself at his side when Y'shua raised Lazarus with the words at the top of this post. He that believes on me and lives shall never die. Those words were probably still ringing in John's ears a couple of weeks later when he is standing inside another empty tomb and he then says of himself that he believed, speaking, of course, by the Holy Spirit. John didn't just believe that Y'shua was alive, he believed that Y'shua was the Resurrection and the Life, and in doing so, possibly became the fulfillment of that very truth.

Thus, after the resurrection, while on the shores of the sea of Galilee, Y'shua tells Peter to follow Him, and not to worry about John for if it were His Will, than John would tarry until He returns. Thus, the rumor went out throughout all the Spirit filled Church, that John would never die. John himself, does not deny this possibility, only qualifies it, as his Lord did, with "IF it were His will" then he will tarry until the return, which, by the way, technically would be referring to the end of the tribulation and thus John may have a ministry to Israel during the tribulation.

Because of this rumor John also ended up earning another name by the early church and it is that Certain One as Paul calls him in one of his epistles.

He is the Certain One who will never die. Thus it is that Justin Martyr tells of his own conversion at the side of a lake by "A Certain Old Man" who introduced him to the Lord, while he was "searching for a lost member of his household."

The teaching of the early church tells us that John, though in his older years (80's possibly) saw a backslidden young believer one day, who, when he saw John, took off running in the other direction in his guilt and John took off after him and caught him and led him back into the fold. This shows us what kind of physical condition that John was in, much like Moses (and Caleb) who maintained their natural strength.

The oldest tradition we have concerning the death of the Beloved Disciple is from the Greek Orthodox Church (they, if anyone, would know since he was last seen in Asia Minor) which states that John told his disciples to bury him alive, which they did (probably in a tomb). Then, they went back for him later but he was gone. Thus, there is no Scriptural evidence that John ever died.

He was commissioned by our Lord to go to "the lost sheep of the house of Israel" which is referring to the ten lost tribes and thus John would have been ordaining elders in and among these people unawares for all this time.

Also, assuredly John would have been involved in any major Translation of the Word, like Erasmus, who knew many different languages and completed a translation of the Word at the expense of rejecting two very lucrative positions in the Catholic Church and in another organization (by the way he used the Received Text which aught to tell you something). Interestingly enough, the individual that convinced King James that they needed a new translation was a guy named John, unfortunately, I don't remember his last name.

So, in the winter of 86/87 while at Bible College in Arizona, I was walking home from the restaurant that I worked at and up ahead of me I see this Certain Old Man standing on the sidewalk and I get the impression from the Spirit that I should witness to this individual. So, when I neared him I asked him if I could ask him a question. He said yes, and so I asked him, "If you were to die tonight, would you go to heaven?"

Immediately he responded, "Heaven, what do you know about Heaven? Where is Heaven?" This particular response caught me off guard, so I sheepishly replied, "Ah, Heaven is where God dwells." To which he said something to the effect that "that's a pretty pat answer" or something like that, but what surprised (and awed) me next was that he began quoting about four or five verses (all of which I recognized) showing me exactly where Heaven is as if he had personally been there (somewhere in "The North"), which John had been to, when he received the Revelation.

After this, he barraged me with questions about the Bible, all of which I successfully answered and this caused him to calm down and he said, "Well, I guess you do know a little bit about the Bible, huh" to which I answered "yeah, a little bit" and then we had an interesting conversation that lasted for about ten minuets or so, during which he told me I was from the tribe of Ephraim, to which I responded "how can you tell" and to which he replied "Oh, I can tell by your eyes and the color of your hair" which, really, should be impossible (if true) for the physical identity of the tribes have been lost for 2700 years, yet he claimed to be able to identify the tribes by their physical characteristics.

By the way I have a condition (Pseudofolliculitis Barbae) when I shave where by, the hairs of my beard are so coarse, that when they are cut with a razor, they immediately curl up under the skin, so that, when they start regrowing, they pierce the skin, and it becomes discomforting, to say the least. That is one of the reasons that I don't shave any more. This condition is well known among black people, and in fact, in the military the blacks are the only ones who can get shaving wavers for this very reason. Now, the reason that I say this is because Ephraim and Manasseh were sired by Joseph and an Egyptian Princess, and thus, their descendants might also manifest this particular skin condition.

Something to think about.

So, after this little discussion, he then told me something that I couldn't believe at the time and so I thought he was either lying to me or crazy, so I broke off the conversation and that is that he had the entire Bible memorized in like forty different languages, or something like that. However, if this were John, who had wandered the entire world, for all these years, and learned the languages of different peoples and translated the Word, hundreds of times, then he could have memorized the Word as he said.

Years later, after I had come to the conclusion that he may be alive, I went back out to Arizona to try and find him, without any luck (forgot to check Messianic Congregations). When I described this individual to one Pastor who had been in the area for about ten years (I toned down the description to only ten languages), this pastor said, "Well, if that's true, then he would have the Apostle Paul beat."

"Yeah, he would" I replied, and hung up.

Now, though I don't know if I should or not, but since I have not heard from this individual again, I assume that he has moved on so I will add this to the story.

Right after I originally posted this, I got a letter from Rosh Kodesh and he quoted one of the Psalms in that I had referenced in that post that John would have seen "many sore troubles". He was responding to my statement that when I had come to the conclusion that John was alive, I opened my Bible to turn to the Revelation at the end of the Bible and the Scriptures actually opened to Psalms 71 instead and I read "now Lord, when I am old and gray don't forsake me until I have shown the generation that is to come your wonderful salvation" and I knew that John was alive. So, Rosh Kodesh was emphasizing to me the struggles that John would have went through, as if he was remembering them himself.

I didn't think much about it for a couple of months but then I got to thinking what if John was alive and ministering to people on the net, wouldn't he, eventually, find his way to the Doves who are watching for the return of the Lord more than any other group of Christians I know? Then I remembered this letter from Rosh. I believe, for other reasons that I am not including here that occurred in our letters, that Rosh Kodesh was this Certain Old Man that I had met in Arizona and I believe that he is John.

It was right after I met this individual that I got the impression that I was supposed to head back to my home in New England (see post the Road to Zion).

This repost is not as detailed as the original, but I guess you get the picture.

And by the way, in Ps 71, the individual is revived three times. For John, this would have occurred the first time after his ministry was ended in Asia Minor at his 'burial' and the second time around 1000 AD for the Lord visits man every morning or every thousand years and He would have visited the beloved disciple then and finally, the third time John will have his youth restored would be at the Rapture. So, I am quite sure I will be seeing John again during the tribulation in Israel. But I may not recognize him then in his new body. For aught we know, he is one of the Four Carpenters that I mentioned in my recent post.

Oh, and one more thing to John, in case he ever reads this.

Y'shua didn't say no, he said, not yet.

Editor's Notes : May 11, 2010 AD :

I wanted to mention a couple of things that I understand now that I didn't back then.

Since Y'shua told me I was his son (physically sired via the Shroud of Turin) and I realized that I have been surrounded by spooks my entire life, I now know how these people are and how they act and how to spot them fairly easily. The point is that John has had to deal with these people for 2000 years.

Take the way we met. If you knew that the entire world "lies in the lap of the wicked one" and that these are the people responsible for killing people (and especially Christians) for all those years and some stranger off the street comes up and asks you if you would go to heaven if you died how would you take that?

You would take it as a threat.

I know that for a fact cause these people have threatened my life countless times. This explains his initial reaction and also his questions for, likewise, these people aren't too bright, Scripturally speaking, and if you ask them any deep theological questions you can tell from their replies that they don't know much about the Spirit or life of the Spirit or the Scriptures ("that's a pretty pat answer"). Thus, when I passed his test he was fairly sure I wasn't a spook or one of the Sons of Darkness as they are known to the people of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

One of the things that Rosh Kodesh mentioned in his letter to me is that "Deception starts with a touch." Now, I have seen this displayed by my enemies on countless occasions and one example will suffice and that is, since I am a smoker, often times when I would go to flick an ash into the ashtray, they would invariably do the same at the same time in order to try and make some type of connection to me and if the reader will consider it for a minute he will realize that this is assuredly why Y'shua passed the sop of Bitter Herbs to Judas who would have reached for the tray at the same time Y'shua did. Now, Rosh knew that I was trying to figure out if he was John or an impostor and it is significant that he would mention this for, not only would John know this, but he was also recalling to my mind to the conditions of our meeting for we didn't even shake hands let alone touch or brush up against each other.

Now, for the record I also wanted to mention that, in fact, he certainly looked Jewish and, not just Jewish but, in fact, he looked like a Levite. Now, the reason that I know that for a fact is that I met a man whose last name was Cohen several years ago (and several years after the events described above) and that is, literally, a Levite and the only ones that can, literally, prove they are Jewish today for the name actually means Priest. He was almost exactly the same heighth and build as the Certain Old Man and the same ears so that, there is no doubt that the man I met in Arizona was a Levite which John is.



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